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Doug,<br>
<br>
Another thought about the core reason.<br>
<br>
Commitment to this. The existing code state (weird, abandoned 2.4.something code) and merge rules seemingly made it impossible to shift development in this direction in any meaningful way, so perhaps it’s chicken and egg... but as long as Lustre is released
and developed primarily out of tree, I can’t see this working. Would it just be a “sync everything but still do releases” approach? Is that viable? Etc.<br>
<br>
Thoughts appreciated.<br>
<br>
- Patrick<br>
<br>
<br>
<hr style="display:inline-block;width:98%" tabindex="-1">
<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size:11pt" color="#000000"><b>From:</b> lustre-devel <lustre-devel-bounces@lists.lustre.org> on behalf of Doug Oucharek <doucharek@cray.com><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, June 7, 2018 8:07:44 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> NeilBrown<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Oleg Drokin; lustre-devel<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [lustre-devel] A new drivers/staging/lustre</font>
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<div class="" style="word-wrap:break-word">What is the focus of landings in this tree? There are two things needing to be done for an upstream Lustre:
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">
<ul class="x_MailOutline">
<li class="">Get the source code to meet the Linux guidelines so it is acceptable to be in mainline.</li><li class="">Get the binary product to have all the features and bug fixes that are in the Intel community tree so end users are interested in using the upstream version (users are unlikely to use a version of Lustre which is not current).</li></ul>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
</div>
<div class="">For the now-deleted staging area, we were supposed to be focusing on the first item but were submitting patches for the second item (syncing with Intel tree). In my opinion, this is the core reason for never being able to get out of staging and
getting deleted.</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">There are some very big (as in code size) features missing from upstream. For example, Multi-Rail. When should that be pushed relative to code cleanups?</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">Doug</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
<div>
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">On Jun 7, 2018, at 4:58 AM, NeilBrown <<a href="mailto:neilb@suse.com" class="">neilb@suse.com</a>> wrote:</div>
<br class="x_Apple-interchange-newline">
<div class=""><span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">On
Thu, Jun 07 2018, James Simmons wrote:</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<blockquote type="cite" class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; orphans:auto; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; widows:auto; word-spacing:0px">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">Greg's patch to remove lustre has now landed in this staging-next tree,<br class="">
so I suspect it will get to Linus before too long. So I have to find a<br class="">
new place to work on lustre.<br class="">
<br class="">
I've added 2 branches to<br class="">
<a href="" class="">git://git.neil.brown.name/linux</a><br class="">
<br class="">
lustre:<br class="">
is based on Greg's patch that removes lustre, and starts with a<br class="">
revert of the patch, followed by a merge of v4.17.<br class="">
I plan to merge each release and RC from Linus, and also<br class="">
add lustre patches that I think are "ready". That will usually mean<br class="">
they have been posted to this list at least a week earlier, and<br class="">
have not had a credible negative response (Acks and Reviewed-by<br class="">
would be nice).<br class="">
I plan to update this branch about once a week, and to never rebase<br class="">
it.<br class="">
</blockquote>
<br class="">
I know Oleg also started to play with a tree but I don't know if he can<br class="">
keep it up like you can. I added the parties interested so they can bless<br class="">
this tree if they want. Mainly Oleg wanted to see what breaks when moving<br class="">
to fs directory and the proper UAPI headers directory as well.<br class="">
</blockquote>
<br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">I'm
certainly happy to contribute to a different tree instead, if</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">someone
else is working towards getting lustre code suitable for</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">upstream.
I created a tree myself because I find that saying "we should"</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">is
not nearly as effective as saying "I have".</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<blockquote type="cite" class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; orphans:auto; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; widows:auto; word-spacing:0px">
<br class="">
Please be patience with me. I normally do this work on the weekend. I put<br class="">
it into my test bed and try it out. Getting reviews can at times be<span class="x_Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
challenging to get. Hopefully people at Cray and Intel are willing to<br class="">
step in for this as well. Patrick from Cray has been most helpful.<br class="">
<br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">lustre-testing:<br class="">
is based on 'lustre' and has most of my current lustre-related work.<br class="">
It includes assorted patches that are not specifically for lustre<br class="">
(rhashtables mostly at the moment). Patches will move from here<br class="">
to 'lustre' or to mainline when they are ready.<br class="">
I plan to update this branch on most days that I work on Lustre,<br class="">
and expect it to rebase frequently.<br class="">
</blockquote>
<br class="">
I had question about that. Some things in Lustre could in theory be merged<br class="">
into the linux kernel proper. Can that be done still?<br class="">
</blockquote>
<br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">What
things?</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">If
it measurably benefits the kernel proper, then I suspect it might be</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">worth
submitting. Things can go direct without going though staging -</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">they
just have to be of good quality with good justification (and</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">sometimes
lots of patience).</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<blockquote type="cite" class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; orphans:auto; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; widows:auto; word-spacing:0px">
<br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">I'm happy to review and, if acceptable, apply patches from other<br class="">
developers. I have fairly high standards, but if I don't accept your<br class="">
patch I'll explain why and possible help fix it.<br class="">
</blockquote>
<br class="">
Also long as you talk to me :-) I'm an easy person to work with. If I<span class="x_Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
refuse a patch with do the same. I might sometimes seem irrational<span class="x_Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
but I have valid reasons. Well at least in my head.<br class="">
<br class="">
We need to really layout the roadmap.<br class="">
</blockquote>
<br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">I
have very little faith in road maps - I prefer to make steps. Once we</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">have
made all the steps, we can look back and see what the map looked</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">like
in retrospect.</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">The
most I'm interested in is "client first, then server".</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">But
feel free to propose something - it is helps you then it could be</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">useful.</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<blockquote type="cite" class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; orphans:auto; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; widows:auto; word-spacing:0px">
<br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">I'm happy to accept enhancements and new features, but these need<br class="">
to be of a quality that would be accepted upstream.<br class="">
</blockquote>
<br class="">
Absolutely. This should be music to some peoples ears.<span class="x_Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
<br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">I'm only interested in client-side code at present - nothing that is<br class="">
only used on the server. I do want to include server-side eventually,<br class="">
but I need some focus for now.<br class="">
</blockquote>
<br class="">
Make sense. Anyways the backend file systems used are ldiskfs which is<br class="">
a heavily modified ext4 filesystem and ZFS on the server side. I doubt<br class="">
the kernel would accept ZFS backend suppport and the changes Lustre<br class="">
does to ext4 have been mostly merged but a few pieces are missing.<br class="">
So pushing the server code at this point wouldn't benefit us.<br class="">
<br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">I hope to get to a stage where the code is of suitable quality that I<br class="">
can submit it to Linux as a new filesystem. I hope that will happen<br class="">
this year.<br class="">
</blockquote>
<br class="">
Are you thinking going back into staging or straight to the fs tree<br class="">
</blockquote>
<br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">Greg
has said he doesn't want it in staging. So no, I'm not thinking of</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">anything
going to staging. I'm thinking of getting enough of a client</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">in
reasonable shape that people can review it without feeling sick or</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">getting
angry.</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">Thanks,</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">NeilBrown</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<blockquote type="cite" class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; orphans:auto; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; widows:auto; word-spacing:0px">
<br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">I hope we can continue to work together to make all this happen.<br class="">
(That's enough hope for now, time to get back to code).<br class="">
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">_______________________________________________</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<span class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; float:none; display:inline!important">lustre-devel
mailing list</span><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<a href="mailto:lustre-devel@lists.lustre.org" class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; orphans:auto; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; widows:auto; word-spacing:0px">lustre-devel@lists.lustre.org</a><br class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px">
<a href="http://lists.lustre.org/listinfo.cgi/lustre-devel-lustre.org" class="" style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:12px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; orphans:auto; text-align:start; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; widows:auto; word-spacing:0px">http://lists.lustre.org/listinfo.cgi/lustre-devel-lustre.org</a></div>
</blockquote>
</div>
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